BikeTuna's winter turbo build

I was thinking about this one yesterday. Good luck mate

 

Love this build! Hope it maps well.

 

Fwiw I reckon you thought wrong there BT. I don't think I'll be the only one on here who has been patiently waiting for you to get things back on track.
Great to hear that you're getting there now mate, fingers crossed for the verdict...

 

+1 for patiently waiting here as well lol.
Good to hear you're back on track work wise etc.
Keep the updates coming mate!

 

Thanks all, it's been a long few months, the bike sale didn't get threatened as there was a few other comoddities that were higher in the queue and got chopped in. Out of the woods now though and much better off for it - all works out in the end!

The Bike is being dropped off on fri 18th, would have been yesterday but couldn't get the day off, would also have been a week before that but couldn't get the day off either.

I'll be spending some time this weekend getting things ready. It hasn't started for a few months so will need the basics, a battery charge, fuel flush and general checkover. I'm sure theres a few other little bits and bobs like securing the coolant catch tank that was missed in the rush to get it out of my last works place that I need to tidy.

I'm glad I made this thread though, Sean at Big CC will be doing a full checkover of the system before they turn the key and I'm sure they will have a lot of questions about the build - after the last few months away from it reading this back reminds me of what I did!

 

Great news been eagerly waiting for an update. Good to hear your sorted mate and wishing a good result for you

 

Well, today was a mixed bag, fitted a new battery as mine wouldnt take a charge, and fired her up for the first time in a few months. Fired straight away, but not without its problems.

Its spitting oil again, am thinking the scavenge pump isnt good enough. It also filled the coolant catch tank in about 5 minutes so there's an all new problem. Great!

Anyway, this has been too long coming so sod it, on tge trailer and off to Big CC Racing.



Spent about 3 hours there in the end, learned loads, watched a busa comfortably pull 260bhp at the wheel on their dyno and saw maps showing their house bike doing a 930bhp run!

Clearly my bike is not their usual but Sean was more than happy to look over mine, not just financially but with genuine interest. Lots is good, some is less so. Definitely needs an boost specific fuel reg setup, uprating the pump was right but pointless without a higher reg, and there is questions on my oil scavenge pump as expected. He did suggest i run a bigger turbo though!!

So fuel reg to go on, pump test then first dyno run- i wonder how it will go!?!?

 

looking forward to your next update

 

I got a call from Big CC today...

The bike is pretty much on track. Changes have been made to my original design. The first problem that have had is the fuel - the standard injectors were not putting in enough fuel for the extra air, so they have fitted a high pressure fuel regulator to over-pressurise the injectors so they put more through. The fuel pressure can now be adjusted to match the boost pressure, and should it progress to higher pressures later on im ready for it.

Also, my oil scavenge pump failed on testing. During dummy electrical testing the pump stopped working completely. I could have just fitted another as it was pretty cheap, but have instead upgraded to a dedicated oil pump and new goodridge lines. If that pump fails when its running the bike will die so the investment will pay in reliability.

There is 1 job left on the list. The bloody eml is still on from the ais/smog removal. Even more annoying, ive binned the valve. Ive ordered a blanking kit from germany that can all go in the bin bar the plug that tricks the eml, and that hasnt arrived yet.

So, provided that when that clip arrives the eml goes out straight away, thr next step is the rolling road.

The concern is no longer the airbox. They are happy that it will hold, and will basically wrap it in lockwire and straps if it doesnt. The problem is if it puts out too much boost. They want to put 8-9 psi through, but wont know how much its doing until the first run. If its doing more and the wastegate wont keep pressures at bay then its major surgery welding ul the turbos internal wastegate and fitting an external wastegate for better control than the crappy vauxhall one will allow. Didnt think of that when i chose it!

They are closing between xmas and new year, i think early jan will be when the bike gets its first taste of full boost - exciting times!

 

Good to see you're still making progress and almost there. I'll keep my fingers crossed for you the first run goes well and look forward to seeing the results.

 

I know you can turn off the SAI with TuneECU, but BigCC don't have it so couldn't do it for me, and I'd forgot about it ad not done it beforehand. Ive not got the software either so even if I had a day off id be down there poking about trying to do things I don't know in the hope of saving £15, so ordering the bypass kit was as easy as anything else.

Anooyingly though, the plug for it is under the tank and airbox, and they are going to charge me to fit it if they cannot do it from the side of the bike, and knowing my design and what a pig it is to take the airbox off now it would be worth my while doing it in their car park myself!

 

You can download the software on the app store. I found it works better via the app thab it does on the laptop. Just need a usb to micro usb adapter to plug it in.

Never had an issue doing it that.

 

Where does it plug into?

I'll try and get it later, don't know whether I can get it on my chromebook but if not the laptop will do it.

Wont be able to get to the mappers though, I'm working more hours than they are over Christmas! If it's not up and running by Sat 7th I'll take a drive over there and take some pics of the new parts and clear the EML if the blanking kit hasn't fixed it.

 

Liked and shared mate!
good luck!

 

Right then... big update time... the good, the bad, and the ugly.


The Good:

It lives! Today the bike made actual boost. The gains are lower than I was originally hoping for at the start of the build, but with my plastic airbox it was to be expected. They are also lower than I was expecting taking a plastic airbox into consideration, and youre not even reading this, you want the numbers....

140ish at the crank, 125 dead at the wheel, at 6.8 psi at 9000rpm. It's boosting from 3krpm, getting to about 6 at 6krpm and squeezing to just under 7psi at 9 and holding to the redline.

Not bad! Standard new is 106bhp at the wheel so with 10 years of a muppet like me glazing the bores its probably at about 95-100bhp, so a 20-25% power gain is lower than I wanted, but not a failure by any stretch of the imagination, as I'd consider a failure to be currently searching ebay for a new block rather than typing this. By the time they get it to 8-9psi it should be pretty healty, maybe 140 at the wheel?

The Bad:

Theres a reason its not putting out more than 7psi, and i'll be honest here and will take the stick like a man, i've built it wrong.

On a properly built setup the turbo wastegate actuator is held closed by the actuator spring and releases pressure by the spring being overcome by the pressure of the exhaust output or by being released by the bike via the vaccuum feed and me, being a weapons grade womble fitted the turbo wastegate actuator backwards, so that the vac is actually holding the wastegate open, exiting all the exhaust gas so it wont boost at all. The only reason its putting out nearly 7psi is a combination of the sheer force 9000rpm outs out the exhaust, and that the back of the wastegate flap catches the inside of the exhaust, holding it from opening right out.

What a bellend, right!

So the actuator needs to be taken off and remounted so that it actions the wastegate door in the opposite direction (yes, i am that stupid!).

The Ugly:

This is throwing up a new issue - control of boost. The Vectra wastegate actuator is a fixed rate spring housed in a mass produced housing with no adjustment capability. The current concern is that we now know the turbo puts out nearly 7psi with the wastegate stuck open, which potentially means that with the wastegate closed may well breach the 9psi cap the bike needs to have before its predicted 10psi detonation point. We need a way of being able to cap the boost, but without spending any money.

So... The bike is coming home again, on a trailer.

To reduce my labour charges at Big CC, I'll be doing as much of the labour as I can. The plan is to remove the turbo, strip out the exhaust housing and then take it back there to have them port the wastegate as large as possible to lower the risk of a sealed system pumping out 15psi out the box, and then rebuilding it with an adjustable wastegate mounted on a new bracket that actuates in the correct direction (yes, i know...) then rebuild it all and take it back. The difference in cost is either £60 to grind out a port off the bike, a piece of steel and a new actuator, or 4 hours of labour to take it off plus 2 hours making a bracket plus an actuator so hopefully saving around £400-500.

There are some positives here. I now know the airbox will take the pressure, I know the dump valve, electronics and manifold are all good, and I know that the additional kit that they have fitted for me (at a cost i didnt want but can at least now justify) are doing their job. I also know that my SAI eliminator kit worked a treat, saving all that TuneECU business. Once the new parts and work is done the boost can go higher and safer with more control so the 125bhp run should be the very minimum its going to make. Also, I'll be able to supply you all here with some new pictures of the oil feed and fuel pressure regulator business.

So... err... yeah. A slap for me, and then the project continues!

 

Yeah???

 

Yeah... I went for a full edit instead of a quick reply and then pressed the wrong button and posted it, now edited...

 

Nice one Tuna I'd say that is in a way a success. At least you know what's needed and won't cost a bomb.
Also that BHP figure isn't terrible considering BHP is a multiple of torque X revs etc so comparing at 9000 revs vs the standard 12ish rpm figure isn't quite the same. You should compare with a standard engine at 9000rpm really. Also guessing you've much better torque and power across the whole rev range which is what you'll really feel on the bike.

 

good work @Biketuna
for a first time, with big learning curve, i dont see any of those issues are anything to be ashamed matey.

firstly, you need to find out the boost value that the actuator spring works at.
when it is installed correctly, it should always protect you from overboost, as that is its job.

if the current spring rate is higher than your max boost value, then you will probably need to change it for a lower value.
if the spring rate is lower than your max boost value, then you can fine tune your boost using an adjustable valve put into the actuator line.

something simple, like a small screw valve will be good enough, as long as you start with it fully open when running the bike, and slowly close it off until you get the max boost you want, rather than close it first and work it open... ;-)

this is the adjustable version of what some people do by inserting different size welding tips into the actuator line until they get the level they want, which is quite common

otherwise, you will be looking at an electronic controller, which you can then customise to smooth out the drop off/open point of the actuator etc.
Or, just get a wastegate spring matched to the max safe boost level you want.